Page 1 of All out or all in?

I'm talking about Europe.
What used to be, and I voted to be in, the European Economic Community. My how the goalposts have moved since the seventies.
I've listened to loads of arguments on the radio whilst working, from balanced and sensible all the way to bile spitting rage and I've yet to came to a conclusion as I don't think there really is a right answer.
Cameron will finish his careering round trying to chat up every other leader and come back with a resounding 'look what I've managed to get us, now we can all vote to stay in'
Even if the only thing he's achieved is a pencil sharpener for the European ministers desk and a weeks free pass to the Berlin brothel of his choice.
It feels to me as if the UK is similar, not in size but attitude, to Texas before it became a state and our fate will be the same sooner or later.

So if any of you have persuasive arguments in either direction there's a vote up for grabs here.
I'm leaning towards staying in at the moment purely on the basis that (To be read in the style of Francis Howard) Once you've been in for so long and so far it's harder to pull out. 


Snaps

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My new Flash Fiction blog. All my own work
500ish

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I used to be with it, but then they changed what `it` was.
Now, what I`m with isn`t it, and what`s `it` seems weird and scary

Dear old Frankie pretty much sums it up. We're so deeply entrenched now that leaving would be socio-economic suicide. There are probably very good reasons for leaving, but most of those arguments tend to be lost in the incoherent bile you speak of, normally from the likes of UKIP, Britain First and the BNP (remember them?), who like to blame all our woes on Johnny Foreigner without looking closer to home first

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Writer`s Release

It's far from perfect, there is a lot of waste, but we do get a lot out of it that most people wouldn't notice. People forget that the free trade agreements mean anything made in Europe, and any skilled workers in Europe, can move about freely.

So any goods that pass through Europe will become more expensive, any goods made by UK companies and sold to Europe will become less competitive. It will also make it harder for UK companies to expand overseas, and European companies to expand here. That will affect jobs.

It'll cost a huge amount of money to decouple us as well, and then another huge amount of money to go back later. And atm we are one of the key member states with special priviledges and voting rights, which we'd lose completely, and never get back if we wanted to rejoin.

We'd also lose a lot of influence in Europe, which ironically is a reason for anti-Europeans to want us to stay. In it, or out of it, like America a lot of what it does affects us. Better to be involved than just whinging on the sidelines.

Also the big lie is Europe does all these horrible things that our governments can't stop. Where it is our own governments that have successively signed leglislation, been part of the debates that defined these things, and ultimately agreed to them.

Personally I'm hoping Cameron gets enough concessions that people will be happy to stay, much like Scotland did with GB. And he's using this threat of a referendum as his leverage. Just hoping it doesn't backfire.

But you can ignore ALL of the above and just think about the following...

Scotland losing the Yes vote meant we hardly ever now have to listen to Alex Salmond. So the choice is simple, do you want to listen to Nigel Farage bang on about Europe for the rest of your or his life, or do you want him to just go away and be a hypocrite arsehole on his own without having to see him on TV all the time.

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Quote:
Rob Shepherd says...
"do you want to listen to Nigel Farage bang on about Europe for the rest of your or his life, or do you want him to just go away and be a hypocrite arsehole on his own without having to see him on TV all the time."
Sold. 


Snaps

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My new Flash Fiction blog. All my own work
500ish

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I used to be with it, but then they changed what `it` was.
Now, what I`m with isn`t it, and what`s `it` seems weird and scary

Quote:
I hold in my hand a piece of paperPeace in our time?

Snaps

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My new Flash Fiction blog. All my own work
500ish

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I used to be with it, but then they changed what `it` was.
Now, what I`m with isn`t it, and what`s `it` seems weird and scary

Better put than I ever could (okay they leave out the getting-stuck-listening-to-farrage argument I gave) but anyway:

http://www.strongerin.co.uk/

Loud voices saying we should leave keep also saying, oh it's fine we'll just negotiate all new treaties, look at this country or that, they do it, there'll be no problem!

Because that's how negotiating works, you make your demands, and the other side just goes "okay then! we love you so much, we'll do anything just to lick your fingernails clean!"

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I don't think anything he's negotiated will change the vote much either way. The whole things going to be decided on a much more visceral level.
People who have already made their minds up and will be casting round for whatever supports their position and conveniently ignoring anything that contradicts it.

Snaps

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My new Flash Fiction blog. All my own work
500ish

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I used to be with it, but then they changed what `it` was.
Now, what I`m with isn`t it, and what`s `it` seems weird and scary

You're probably right there.

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I'm voting NON!

I want our Australian and New Zealand meat back on the UK counters instead of the Euro Sausage 

We drink your wine instead of French alcohol, what more do you want? Ex colonies... never happy.

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