Page 1 of Back to the Future Region 2 - progressive coding or interlaced?

hi,

i wanna buy this trilogy, but dunno which to go for. region 2 has dts, which is a plus. but, i know for sure that the region 1 will be coded using progressive scanning. most region 2`s are not - some are (eg speed x-treme edition, star wars ep2) but some aren`t (the se7en 2-disc edition, annoyingly, isn`t).

so before i waste my money and get good sound with a kinda `ish` picture, does anybody have any info on this?

if you own a harman kardon dvd player, hit the info button when the film is playing and it should tell you what coding it is (it will say progressive, interlaced or alternate, which is the disney term for interlace, it seems). hit info again and it will show what settings your own player is at (please do not get confused between the two screens).

much obliged - your help is greatly appreciated.

sincerely,
Saqib.

So what advantage doe non interlaced scanning have over interlaced given that the TV is going to use interlacing to display the picture? unless you are on a very large flat panel screen or porjection TV Probably a silly question I know.

I have the R2 box set and the picitre on a Pansonic Quintrix widescreen Tv is crystal clear

Steve

It`s not the DVD that determines if it`s interlaced or progressive scan, it`s the equipment you are using.

hi,

yeah i have a plasma screen hence why i want prog scan.

the disc also makes a difference - believe me. you can compare two versions of the same film - for example, the crouching tiger region 1 is prog encoding, and i compared it to the superbit region 2 version - the superbit sucked in comparison - why? it was still encoded using interlacing. i promptly returned it.

if you compare the two versions of speed - the newer 2 disc versus the original single you can see the difference (personally i can) - the new one was encoded using progressive scan whereas the original was interlaced.

yuck.

thanks for your help anyway guys.

i guess i will have to rent them and find out myself. waste of £4 tho :(

It`s not just the framerate difference?

Ste

nope.

Saqib

You`re getting very confused here.

NO dvd is `encoded` with a progressive scan picture! All dvd`s are encoded with a standard 525, (NTSC) or 625(PAL) line picture which is refreshed at either 50hz or 100hz by your tv or plasma/lcd in one pass from top to bottom. As each line is drawn very quickly the light in the tube is still emiting from the first pass and can cuase flicker - this is typically why 100hz tv`s have characteristically less flicker, (though not always).

Progressive scan gets around this by drawing the whole picture in one hit, rather than odd and even passes of light on each line from top to bottom on screen. This gives benefits for a few reasons;

[list]
[*]As the screen is drawn in one whole pass, there is literally next to no flicker. This gives the picture a much smoother appearance and also allows colours to remain more vivid, especially on NTSC sources.
[*]The visible line structure of the picture you can sometimes see on NTSC discs is almost eradicated, an especially handy thing if you`re using a large plasma or projector.
[/list]

DVD`s are NOT encoded in progressive form, they are all encoded in standard interlaced video form and the progressive scan is performed by the hardware, you can`t make a dvd draw it`s picture in one pass - it`s impossible!! So the tv/plasma or, typically, the DVD player perform the progressive operation accordingly.

You mention you have a Harman DVD player. Now, i`m almost sure you`re using the DVD25, which has PAL/NTSC progressive scan as standard, and also your plasma will accept this so you`re gettting the benefit right away, as long as you have engaged the Prog Scan mode on the DVD25 you`re in business.

Don`t be confused, the bottom line is that Prog Scan is only achieved in the hardware domain and not with the DVD itself, it is just not possible.

So to answer your thread title question, BTTF region 2 has an interlaced PAL 625 line picture, it`s NTSC region 1 cousin has a 525 line interlaced picture running at 24frames per second which will cause the scan lines to be visible and the motion to be slightly jerky due to the lower, (1 FPS difference against PAL but still noticeable), FPS count.

To eliminate this, switch the DVD 25 to progressive NTSC mode and watch most of the NTSC bugbears disappear :)

There, that`s better!!


Westy

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"Don`t be confused, the bottom line is that Prog Scan is only achieved in the hardware domain and not with the DVD itself, it is just not possible."

That`s not quite true. For progressive scan to work properly the disk does have a part to play, in that the frames must be flagged appropriately. If this is incorrect, as with the recent R1 version of "Meaning of Life" a progressive player will produce a faulty picture, as noted here and here.

Of course, the Meaning of Life is an isolated example where it has gone wrong, and your basic argument that Saqib has got confused is correct.

This item was edited on Sunday, 28th September 2003, 20:53

ok let`s make this easier using some examples to show you what i mean.

go to this website - i took some pictures of the various dvds in different bits:

uk.f1.pg.photos.yahoo.com/saqibhasan101

i hit the info button to show firstly the DISC information, and then hit it again to show the PLAYER settings.

1 - hero - ntsc - disc info shows it is scanned (and therefore encoded) as interlaced
2 - hero - ntsc - player settings show the scan output as prog and the disc as NTSC
3 - speed - pal - disc info - note progressive setting for the scan type
4 - speed - pal - player settings show the scan type and the disc as PAL
5 - speed - pal - the menu shows the same disc info (see pics 9 onwards to understand why the menu etc is important)
6 - speed - pal - and the menu shows the same output setting
7 - speed - pal - the film itself STILL has the same disc info setting (Prog)
8 - speed - pal - and the film still has the same player output settings (PAL)
9 - star wars ep 2 - pal - by the same company as speed yet the DISC info shows interlaced
10 - star wars ep2 - pal - and the player settings show PAL with prog out
11 - star wars ep2 - pal - the scan type is show as INTERLACED
12 - star wars ep2 - pal - but output is still prog and PAL
13 - star wars ep2 - pal - this is the fun bit - the menu shows scan type as...PROG!
14 - star wars ep2 - pal - and the settings are still unchanged.

incidentally, and this you may not be able to appreciate unless you have the full size pictures that i do (i downsized them to upload - 56k sux), but you can see the difference between the interlaced images and the prog images.

my point is this - not all ntsc disc are progressive scan-encoded, not all pal discs are interlaced. but there is definately something else aside from just the player settings that influence the progressive nature of the movie.

as far as the bttf set goes, i am awaiting the arrival of part one on pal disc and if insha`Allah (God willing) it is prog-encoded, and (from what i hear) the sound difference between the dts and dolby dig tracks is not a big deal, then region one it is. i will let you know what the info shows on the films when i get them.

ok so lemme know what you think please.

sincerely,
Saqib.

This item was edited on Monday, 29th September 2003, 01:31

just watch the films, theres more to life than worrying about scans and interlacing bollocks.

floyd
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